Rossi Rifleman

My Savage 93R17 (bolt action, synthetic stock, stainless barrel, 17 HMR) is very accurate.

Using the newer CCI A17 ammo, hitting near dead center of a target at 100 yards is routine,
IF shooting from a solid bench with good forend and butt rests.
However, shooting accuracy decreases when using only forend support and no butt rest.

And when shooting from an unsupported standing position, let's just say that the wings of the flies
in Jed Clampett's garden are safe.

So first off, a tip of the hat to all of you that have hunted successfully from the unsupported standing postion.

And secondly, has anyone else sought to quantify how much accuracy is lost when support is not available?

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And what would you consider a realistic effective range for an unsupported rifle shot while hunting?

Mrlucky353 wrote:And what would you consider a realistic effective range for an unsupported rifle shot while hunting?

I feel your pain. I don't know what the accuracy loss for other is but it can really affect me personally. I've loss a bit of time, memory wise, because of the all the hours spent coding on this forum, but in the middle of one night while hacking away at the keyboard I stood up and looked outside and two boar hogs were tearing up my yard about 75 yards out. The short story is I snuck out into my barn and shot off the top of my planter that was attached to tractor. I was standing up, leaning over slightly and I thought the very thing that you are thinking; "I wish I had a bit of butt stock support as I'm a bit unstable." I went ahead and took the shot but it was less than perfect and for a big boar hog with the 357 Mag rifle at 75 yards you need perfect. I found him, or the buzzards did, two days later.

It affects me. Last night finishing up on the AT&T hacks and look out and see one hog coming into the yard. I need to finish some code or I will loose my chain of thought so hack it out and by the time I slip out there are a dozen big hogs in my yard, all 150 pounds plus. I have a wood block on the side of a tree just off my porch and that standing, unsupported shot a couple of nights ago still buggered me. I decided to slip through the garage/barn and find a better rest. In the dark I turn the barn door knob ever so carefully, I keep them lubed good for this very reason, but bigger than Dallas the knob's lock works go "ping" as a peep out the are all hauling butt. Super quite outside and the light "ping" was like momma's china breaking on the title kitchen floor.

So, yes, butt stock support does matter especially when you don't have it and it has caused me some heartache over the years.

Rock, tree, fence post, sit on my butt, anything but just stand there and miss. Door jam, I just lean on the wall and rest the front wood on my thumb, Artillery hold only.

Off-hand shooting is just plain tough. I never take unsupported shots on small game beyond 25 yards or medium game beyond a 100. I always try to find some kind of support, even if it is just a tree. I've been shooting cowboy silhouette matches the last 3 years and it has helped my off-hand shooting more than anything else I've tried. Even so, my 50 yard groups from the bench with the .357 model 92 average around a half inch, but off-hand groups average between 3 to 4 inches. (Or in other words, not that great)

I only ever had two that felt good just standing there. My 12 lb Hawken, and the LONG barrel 1894 with a full magazine,, oh yah, thats why I want the 24" model 92......I forgot, seriously, that big Hawken is so heavy, it cant move fast, so worst case It just waves slowly back and forth, instead of shaking. 36" tube on that baby, 1" across the flats.

I shoot a fair bit of both scoped silhouette and cowboy silhouette, all which is done off hand. The scoped in centre fire is out to 500m, cowboy with open sights out to 200m. Recently I've been having a play with the service rifle version, which is the targets at 200,300,385 and 500m. My best so far in that is 15/40, using a refurbished 1903A3 with original open sights in 30-06.
An issue that I come across with people's ability to shot from any position other than off the bench is a lack of practice with a low power rifle (.22 rim fire or air rifle). As a range officer and an accredited instructor, it's amazing how many people are buying high powered rifles as their first gun. My advice to new shooters is to get a .22 rim fire, a case of ammo and then go shoot as much and as often as you can in as many different competitions or situations as you can.
It's all about practice. At one of the shoots I run we had our best shooter put 5 shots completely inside a 12mm circle at 50m, using an upright post, left hand on post and rifle across left forearm. That's less than 0.5 moa. As I said, it's all about practice and getting to know how your rifle works.

Greetings
This is one reason I do the bulk of my "target" shooting with cross sticks. It forces me to learn to shoot well with minimal support. Plus I can usually take my cross sticks with me to hunt as I normally walk out and sit overlooking a river bottom area.
"Off a bench with all the baggies I can also shoot nice little groups. But what good is it all if I cannot reproduce it where it matters". That is what a fellow shooter said to me when I stated shooter steel critters back in 82. So I did my load development and practice laying on my back just as I would be doing at matches.
Then when the yearn to shoot BP cartridge rifles hit me it was again shown to me by a feller who only shot original Sharps. Basicly his idea was to never shoot off a bench and only on cross sticks. That way even a bad load was still good practice doing it the way the match was shot.
So if all you do is shoot paper then what ever. But I think the best practice is to practice the way you will have to shoot out there where ever it will be.
Mike in Peru

Bibletotingunslinger wrote:Rock, tree, fence post, sit on my butt, anything but just stand there and miss. Door jam, I just lean on the wall and rest the front wood on my thumb, Artillery hold only.

Bibletotinggunslinger, up to what caliber do you like to use the artilliary hold?

http://www.pyramydair.com/article/The_a ... ne_2009/63