Giving up on my M92 .357

[galaxieman]

Well, I have had my M92 apart 8 times since buying it used(looked new except for the messed up loading gate) from a local gun store about 8 months ago. Since it was used and someone else tried a little home gunsmithing on it I cant get any help from Rossi. I did get the loading gate worked out and got it to feed 38 pretty well, but nothing I have done will make it feed 357. The rim catches on the guides and refuses to lift and slide into the chamber. Seems to be a common problem but the fix must be to send it to Steve young and spend another $200 to get this $400 rifle to work as it should have from the factory.I have done every trick known to man besides sending it off with money I refuse to spend on a rifle I already paid for. If this problem was rare I would not blame Rossi, but it is not. Steve Young makes a living correcting these so I am officially done with Rossi. I will sell this rifle and let the new owner it is a 38 only and just wait for a Marlin or buy a Henry.

[pricedo]

At this point you have nothing to lose.
Put the rifle away, go have a few beer, watch some TV and forget totally about that rifle for a couple of days.
After that try again with a fresh mind & perspective.
I'd start with the basics....... strip down, de-greasing with alcohol/brake parts cleaner, thorough cleaning, deburr, polish, light lube & reassemble..........that solves the problems 90% of the time.
Probably a few metal burrs (machining rough spots) messing with the operation of the cartridge lifter, ejector, etc.
Maybe a good time to install some lighter springs (Brownell, Lee spring kits).

[akuser47]

I agree with pricedo you will only loose more if you give up now. Put it up and then get her out again once you have a clear and present mind. They can frustrating for sure takes time to get them dialed.

[Tuco Ramirez]

At this point you have nothing to lose.
Put the rifle away, go have a few beer, watch some TV and forget totally about that rifle for a couple of days.
After that try again with a fresh mind & perspective.
I'd start with the basics....... strip down, de-greasing with alcohol/brake parts cleaner, thorough cleaning, deburr, polish, light lube & reassemble..........that solves the problems 90% of the time.
Probably a few metal burrs (machining rough spots) messing with the operation of the cartridge lifter, ejector, etc.
Maybe a good time to install some lighter springs (Brownell, Lee spring kits).

And wait several weeks or a month. They can and will get under your skin. Nature of the beast with these rifles.

[Trailboss]

...got it to feed 38 pretty well, but nothing I have done will make it feed 357. The rim catches on the guides and refuses to lift and slide into the chamber....

galaxieman, Your rifle certainly has a preference for shorter cartridges being that the 38 Special loads but the 357 doesn't. Have you tried seating the 357 leads a bit deeper to see if it helps? What type of bullets are you trying in the 357? Mine won't load wad cutters at all.

Try seating the 357 a bit deeper and try it. If it fails to load, seat it just a bit deeper to see if you can find the maximum length that loads. It might be possible to find a load that it prefers in the 357.

tb

[ironhead7544]

Try taking the guides out and polishing the curved surface the rim catches on. My 44 Magnum developed the same problem after about 500 rounds fired. Those surfaces came highly polished out of the box. I used a Dremel with a soft tip and polishing compound. Might work for you.

[galaxieman]

I have already tried all the known fixes. Yes I am sure I could make custom shorter 357rounds and come up with something that might work. But that is still unacceptable for me. Having to work on a new rifle to get it to work with ammo it is designed for is BS. That is like buying a new car and then having to rebuild the engine to get it to run. As I said in my first post, if my issues were rare, I would just right it off as a poor example, but it seems to be the norm. Admittedly, I bought this rifle because the Marlin 1894 I really want has gotten too hard to find and too expensive. but if I end up with this $500 rifle and $200 to get Steve to fix it then I could have just bought what I really wanted. Or at least gotten close. I am convinced that someone could get this to work, it just wont be me. Rossi needs to include Steve's DVD with the purchase of these. The internet is full of stories on these not cycling correctly. I cant see how they have stayed in business. Sorry guys, I have only so many minutes to spend with my guns, and trying to get one to work is wasted time.

[donhuff]

Is the chamber a little rough? Sometimes polishing it will let the bullet slid in easier. Also polish the two radius/sloped part of the ejector where it contacts the back of the cartridge. If it is rough, the rim cannot slide up the ejector, and the round gets some DOWNward force,along with the forward push. And the downward force hits just as the nose of the bullet gets into the chamber. The 38 will work cause it is not long enough to get the nose into the chamber very deep before the rim gets up and clear of the grooves in the guides.

Also, After I put a weaker EJECTOR spring in mine, that allowed the ejector to retract all the way into the bolt when it contacts the rim with a little force. That lets everything work a lot easier and feed smoother, takes away some of that downward force. I know it will mean taking it apart again but, take the ejector spring out and reassemble it and give it a try. While you have the ejector out, stone/sand polish the whole thing where it contacts the cartridge.........................out to the shop

Well, to check out what I saying. I went out to the shop and got a few dummy rounds and cycled them to see again what is going on. Most of what I said look to be about right. Light springs and polishing EVERYTHING usually helps to make it smoother. But to be sure, I made up a dummy that was longer on purpose. I mostly shoot the Lyman 358429 Keith style bullet, and it is a little on the long side for most 357s. Crimped in the groove mine come out at 1.630- 1.640. I made this one at 1.702. It works on the carrier cause I filed the cartridge stop back some and took a little off from the bottom of the barrel where it could swing up past it. Everything works good until the lead is about 3/4 of the way into the chamber, and the rear of the cartridge needs to lift up through the grooves in the guides. Then it locks up in that position. The nose it hitting the top of the chamber, the case it hitting the "ramp" on the bottom of the barrel, and the rim is not far enough forward to go up the grooves yet.

So from that I can see, a bullet with a wide nose is going to make the problem happen with a shorter OAL than say a bullet like the Keith which has a smaller nose/meplat or a round nose. Also the OAL will have a big effect on it. To prove this out, I just went out to the shop again, and loaded one of my bullets upside down, now that's a wide meplat! I had to keep seating it deeper until I got it to 1.510 before it would chamber. If your chamber does not have much of a "ramp" that will make it harder. It's not so much that the sharp edge digs into the case, but that it adds a fulcrum point to the cartridge (like a see saw) and for the nose to go down, the rim has to go up but the guides are in the way(instead of it sliding forward on the top of the chamber till the rim gets in the grooves... hopefully just before the side of the case hits the ramp). And a big nose bullet WILL lower the side of the case to where it might touch the ramp sooner. Mine doesn't have much of a ramp, but it is there. There were a couple of pictures of the ramp in a new 454 a while back. And lastly, I have seen a post where RD shows how to file the grooves in the guides further to the rear to make more room for a longer cartridge. Ever see the "pregnant looking" brass that comes out of a Glock? That's because of a big ramp. And a Glock will feed almost anything without a hiccup.

What style bullet nose are you trying? Tried any other type bullet shape? Does you barrel have a ramp?

[donhuff]

Oops, seems like I'm too late to the party and you have already written it off. It takes me a long time to type and 5 trips out to the shop trying to figure it out took a while.

Remember the thing was actually designed way back even before there was a 357 cartridge.When it was designed it was made for 32-20 38-40 44-40 and later 25-20. All bottleneck rounds that feed smoother than any straight wall case.

And I'm not so sure that a marlin will be slick as glass right out of the box either. My son's 44 was a chore to get to feed anything reliably. And it is an older one.

I can remember my older brother bought a new 1967 chevelle SS396 and had about half of the motor out the same week. Why, cause he wanted it to run like HE wanted it to run and not the way GM designed it.....That thing would fly! While I never did that with a new car, I did do it with used ones. Hell, I bought a few that didn't even have a motor.

[galaxieman]

Don, thanks for your time and input, you may have really said something that might be part of the issue. The ejector on mine was already messed with when I got it. I did polish it but the way you described it makes me think mine may be bad. You said it is beveled or something to that effect. Mine is not. In fact watching the action I thought about modifying it to have a bevel to cause a lift to the back of the cartridge. The two surfaces are not beveled at all. Also the spring is really stiff as you mentioned and the thing sends brass into orbit when cycled with any speed. Hum?? I may have to see if I can order a new ejector and spring. I would probably be willing to try that. Anyone have a picture of what the ejector is supposed to look like?
Thanks