Lot's of Hoopla Over Ruger's PC Carbine For SD - But

[Deleted User 327]

Lots of 'vibe' over Ruger's new PC carbine. People jumping all over it's increased performance over a semi-auto handgun. But . . . . is a 9mm carbine really that much better than a pistol? Might be enough but it's interesting to consider. Also, how does it compare to other pistol calibers used in longer barreled carbines and/or rifles? How would the SAAMI 35,000psi peak class 9mm compare to it's closest caliber neighbor, the SAAMI 35,000psi peak class 357 mag? Let's see.

Why don't we do an 'apples to apples' comparison between a 124grn .356 dia 9mm compared to a 125grn .357 dia 357mag as well as a 147grn .356 dia 9mm compared to a 158grn .357 dia 357mag using BBI's data in 16" carbines. Using BBI's data, we can also pick the same type commercial ammo; Federal JHPs, making it a true 'apples to apples' comparison of like to like.

Let's also just compare just 16" barrel lengths as this is a discussion about carbines, not the performance as compared to longer barreled rifles as the Ruger PC is only available with a 16" barrel. The results of a review of BBI's data on the Federal JHPs are as follows:

125grn Class Bullets
124grn .356 dia 9mm: Federal 124grn Hydra-Shok JHP - 16" MV = 1,243fps producing 425ft/lbs ME.
125grn .357 dia 357mag: Federal 125grn JHP - 16" MV = 2,051fps producing 1,158ft/lbs ME.
(The 357mag produces a 65% higher muzzle velocity and 2.72 times the muzzle energy from a slightly larger, heavier bullet than the 9mm)

150grn Class Bullets
147grn .356 dia 9mm: Federal 147grn Hydra-Shok JHP - 16" MV = 1,073fps producing 376ft/lbs ME.
158grn .357 dia 357mag: Federal 158grn Hydra-Shok JHP - 16" MV = 1,741fps producing 1,063ft/lbs ME.
(The 357mag produces a 62% higher muzzle velocity and 2.83 times the muzzle energy from a slightly larger, but heavier bullet than the 9mm)

Further, while that performance increase may not be necessary at a 12' range, as the distance to the target increases or if any barriers are in between the bullet and the BG, then that velocity and muzzle energy difference could very well be vital.

Add to this discussion the fact that I recently chrono'd my own 357mag handloads designed for a longer barrel using Lil'Gun powder and Zero 158grn JSP bullets with the following results. Recently they chrono'd 158grn JSP handloads produced 1,952fps MV and 1,337ft/lbs of ME out of my 20" Rossi carbine and 2,005fps MV and 1,410ft/lbs MV out of my 24" Rossi rifle.

So, my carbine produces over 3 times the ME of my 45acp 1911, twice the ME of even my 45 Super pistol, and 160ft/lbs more ME than my 62grn, 2,920fps MV 5.56 handloads from my 18" Mini-14!

So, comparing the 357mag's real, demonstrated performance to the 16" 9mm carbine data above, the 357mag fired from a 20" carbine has even more advantage over the 9mm Ruger PC carbine. Something to consider.

[bigloop92]

I do admit I'm rather disappointed the 9mm doesn't jump in velocity in a rifle like the 357 does. Other than that it's still a great little gun. I love the break down feature. The ambidextrous options make it sweet for me being a lefty. I didn't buy mine to hunt with, but I feel confident I could with the right ammo, and keeping shorter ranges. It's +p rated and Buffalo Bore has some neat options. Some of the advantages of the PC .... (1) fun factor, these things are a hoot. (2) near zero recoil. (3) very accurate. (4) tons of mag options from 10 - 33 rounds. I shoot ball ammo for fun and have four 17 round P-Mags full of hollowpoints for when SHTF....

[mr surveyor]

Between 2005 and 2010, I had 9mm carbines from both Kel-Tec (Sub 2000) and Beretta (CX4-Storm). They both were entertaining range toys that could shoot quite a bit of ammo in a relatively short time .... and hit a pie plate (carefully aimed) at 50 yards .... usually. Oddly enough, the K-T S2K was always more accurate on target than the much more expensive CX4 (with an ATN sight). I finally realized that the 9mm round was very inferior for my general needs at the time, and even had less use for home defense than the shorty Mossberg 500's. I graduated from the 9mm carbine class in about 2011.

I would like to have the old Kel-Tec S2K back, just because it was unique and fairly reliable, but I'd lots rather have another lever gun.

jd

[Mad Trapper]

It wouldnt upset me if Ruger decided to bring the 44 carbine back into production.



https://www.americanrifleman.org/articl ... 4-carbine/

[Sarge]

The 9mm is at its best from a SMG where you can pour in a handful of them with a point-press. I've used or been issued the Uzi, MP5 and Colt SMG at various times. These PCC's do not appeal to me.

[TinMan]

It wouldnt upset me if Ruger decided to bring the 44 carbine back into production.



https://www.americanrifleman.org/articl ... 4-carbine/

PLEEEEEEEESE bring it back...........

[golfish]

All I know is, I can hit a 12" steel plate at 100 yards with the pcc9 carbine. I'd be lucky if I could hit my truck at a 100 yards with my glock.

[GasGuzzler]

Yep, all that.

I still want a Sub2K in 9mm. Make it the Glock model as I don't have an M/P or B92 either.

It folds in half and there are no worries on damaging the finish by it riding in the truck. Gone are the days of the gun rack in the back window (for me at least). For home defense, it's a Maverick 88 or one of several small arms. I'm not a rifle inside the house kind of guy.

[GRV01]

An apples to apples comparison would also take into account the platform itself.

Missing from your assessment was the fact that the PCC is threaded for a suppressor and has an integral rail for a light -- two accessories that are ideal for a home defense gun that are missing from any lever without modification

Further, a 357 mag fired in youe home down the hallway at the Bad Guy *will* deafen you, perhaps permanently. A 9mm less so, esp3cially suppressed

That being said, i doubt ill ever own a PCC, that is, until someone engineers a nice wood stock option

[Mad Trapper]

The 9mm, with HOT loads, can get the job done in a pinch.

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l ... tail&p=388

I wander if that ruger can handle 9mm hot loads?
If it could, on a steady diet, it could be something to consider