454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

The Rossi Model R92, a lightweight carbine for Cowboy Action, hunting, or plinking! Includes Rossi manufactured Interarms, Navy Arms, and Puma trade names.

Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby remus » 12 Jul 2017 11

I think any handgun, or handgun cartridge in a long gun would be marginal on a PO'd big bear. Take the 45-70. Why play games with your life. So it's a little heavier, big deal. It is probably your life saver in a pinch.
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby Ranch Dog » 12 Jul 2017 17

remus wrote:I think any handgun, or handgun cartridge in a long gun would be marginal on a PO'd big bear. Take the 45-70. Why play games with your life. So it's a little heavier, big deal. It is probably your life saver in a pinch.

Kind of where I would sit. My rifles:
  • Rio Grande 45-70 Govt - 7.18 Lbs
  • R92 454 Casull - 7.14 lbs
These rifles both have scopes. Without the tube, rings and base they weigh:
  • Rio Grande 45-70 Govt - 6.28 Lbs
  • R92 454 Casull - 6.53 lbs
The traditional scope on the Rio Grande is heavier than the scout on the R92 making the RG a ¼ lb lighter than the R92. Both have 20" barrels, overall, the RG is ¾" longer.

I personally think that the RG4570 is one of the most underrated leverguns out there. It is a full pound lighter than my Marlin Guide gun and two pounds lighter than the 1895 rifle. It would shoot inside either of those rifles, both are reasons why these JM Marlins are no longer on the ranch.

Back to the Rossi products, My RG4570 on its worst range day will produce better accuracy than my R92 on its best range day. Part of it is the generic 1:30 twist that Rossi bestowed on all R92 barrels. When it comes to terminal performance, the 454 Casull will never equal the 45-70 Govt.

Both are out of production but indications are that the Rio Grande 45-70 has a better chance of returning than the 454 Casull. I would hope they both do, I do like them both, but when it comes to larger predators I would rather have the lighter Rio Grande with its greater terminal performance in hand. I would shoot the Beartooth 525-grain Pile Drivers and go about my business.
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby GasGuzzler » 12 Jul 2017 17

RD, are your R92s all the newer style and is the Rio Grande a 336/1894 style? Do all RGs have a safety other than half cock or on the lever itself? Sorry for the newb questions but the RG4570 sounds interesting to look for as I have no "giant" calibers.
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby Ranch Dog » 13 Jul 2017 07

GasGuzzler wrote:RD, are your R92s all the newer style and is the Rio Grande a 336/1894 style? Do all RGs have a safety other than the half cock or on the lever itself? Sorry for the newb questions but the RG4570 sounds interesting to look for as I have no "giant" calibers.

All my 92s are of Braztech manufacture. The Rio Grande is a 336 clone. The base 336 has a half cock hammer with a two piece firing pin. Lever pressure uses the Finger Lever Plunger to release the Trigger Safety Block and acts upward against the Locking Bolt with aligns both halves of the Firing Pin. The Rossi, like later models of the Marlins, use a Hammer Cross Bolt Safety.

I only use the 92's safety on the bolt and the CBS when I'm in my reloading, at the range, or empty a tube of cartridges (even in the field). While stand or still hunting, I don't use the bolt or CBS.

Rossi did their design homework getting that fat 45-70 cartridge around the innards while maintaining the slim receiver of the basic 336. Had Marlin done this, I'm willing to be that there would never have been a 444 Marlin.

In that the RG is a 336 and not 1895, I limit my loads to 35.0K PSI vs. the 40.0 to 42.0K PSI typically used with the 1895. That statement is the typical 1895 lovers claim against the RG. The bottom-line is that with heavy bullets the 7K PSI makes little difference in terminal performance. I've recorded results with my RG from both the 35.0K vs. 42.0K PSI using:
  • BL-C(2)
  • Benchmark
  • H322
  • H335
  • H4198
  • H4895
  • Varget
  • W748
On average, the extra 7.0K PSI represents 45 FPS or less with a 425-grain bullet.
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby GasGuzzler » 13 Jul 2017 12

Great info others likely know. I'd rather ask here.

I have an R92 and a 336, both without safeties. I'm mildly familiar with the innards of the 336 as I had to replace the front firing pin in mine.

The FPS/pressure difference is nothing to worry about in my book.
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby HarryAlonzo » 14 Jul 2017 00

Ranch Dog wrote:
I only use the 92's safety on the bolt and the CBS when I'm in my reloading, at the range, or empty a tube of cartridges (even in the field). While stand or still hunting, I don't use the bolt or CBS.



I had the Steve's Gunz peep in my bolt safety for awhile, but replaced it. I like having the bolt safety for unloading, especially.
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby Warhawk » 19 Aug 2017 01

I have this Browning 92 in 44 Magnum. I bought it close to 20 years ago from an old gentleman at a Salt Lake City gun show. He had just moved back from Alaska, said he was getting too old for the winters up there. Anyway, this 44 had served as his bear defense rifle for many years. I asked if he had ever killed a bear with it, he just said "yeah it works".
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby Ranch Dog » 19 Aug 2017 07

That is a very nice looking 92!
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby akuser47 » 22 Aug 2017 20

Looks great that rock is a nice backdrop to. Lol
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Re: 454 enough to stop coastal brown bear?

Postby Warhawk » 26 Aug 2017 01

akuser47 wrote:Looks great that rock is a nice backdrop to. Lol


That was our backyard when we lived in Utah. I think that rock came from the Weber river, which was about a mile away.
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