Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

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Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by Moon Tree »

I'm looking through loads for the 45 in LoadData.com and I'm seeing a difference in maximun loads for Lil'Gun under 300 grain bullets of the Speer's JFP and the XTP. So I was wondering while these 300 grain Jacketed bullets would be different.

Speers 300 grain JFP lists 20.2 gr of Lil'Gun as max loads at 1203 fps
XTP 300 grain lists 17.7 gr of Lil'Gun as max loads at 1197 fps
THESE OF RUGER ONLY LOADS
I'm working up a deer/black bear load for next year.

Current hunting load for the .45 colt is:
Lee's C452-300 with 23 gr of H-110 moving at 1566 fps out of the 20" barrel Rossi. It smack a deer pretty darn well. And I don't feel I would be under gunned using it for bear. I just wanted to try some XTP's

Thought and suggestion are welcome, as always.
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by Ranch Dog »

The immediate issue of the Speer #4485 is finding the durn things but I've never fancied the XTP other than for self defense use in handguns but even prefer the Speer Gold Dots in that role. I'd even prefer the Lee cast bullet to the XTP.

I'm also a loaddata.com subscriber, been so for years, but I often find their data lacking in that they don't fully describe most loads with bullet lengths, recommended cartridge OAL, and specific pressures.

All three of the bullets you mentioned have different lengths, even though they are the same weight, so that effects powder compression and pressure. Without the specific cartridge OALs used with the loaddata.com data it is tough to tell you why there is a difference.

Real quick and using the same cartridge OAL of 1.600" for all three with a 32.5K PSI load for the Rossi 92, I ran them through QuickLoad. Here are the results for a 20" barrel

Lee C452-300-RF
Bullet Length: .750"
Lig'Gun: 25.2 grains at 1730 FPS
H110: 25.5 grains at 1670 FPS

Hornady XTP #45230
Bullet Length: .778"
Lig'Gun: 24.1 grains at 1690 FPS
H110: 24.3 grains at 1625 FPS

Speer #4485
Bullet Length: .732"
Lig'Gun: 25.4 grains at 1730 FPS
H110: 25.7 grains at 1670 FPS

Hornady publishes this chart for the XTP but I found the velocity ranges narrower. I haven't used the bullets in this century (funny how we can say that) but I did try the 35 and 44 offerings in 35 Rem, 44 Mag, and 444 Marlin rifle but found their performance lacking on whitetails and hogs.
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by 9x80Drilling »

I'll chime in with my limited experience with the .45 XTP; please take it as such.
Rossi 92, SS, 16".
3 whitetails last year, 4 muleys this year. 250 gr XTP over 24.5 gr LilGun. All broadside shots; some hit chest cavity, some farther back. Complete penetration in all instances. No bullets recovered.
According to the Hornady chart that RD linked, the velocity may be too high for the standard 250 XTP. MV is certainly over 1700 fps;velocity at 50 to 100 yards is unknown at this time but may be down to the upper limit listed on the chart. I don't know.
I found no bullet fragments in the deer. This might mean the bullets held together well, or it may mean I just didn't see the the scraps of lead or jacket material. I always look very closely as I gut and as I process my animals; I'm intensely curious about bullet performance. I've "finished" several other deer for other hunters with other than broadside shots. No evidence of bullet failure there.

Next year if I hunt elk with the 92, I will have worked up loads using the 240 XTPMag and the 300 XTPMag.
My sense is that the 250 XTP in .45 at higher velocity works very well for deer. Whether or not the Mag versions are better, I can't say. For hogs or black bear I think I'd prefer the Mag versions. I wouldn't hesitate to use the standard 250 XTP if that was what I was carrying.
BTW, accuracy has been wonderful with the 250.
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by Ranch Dog »

There you go Moon Tree, recent and successful experience with the XTP. Thanks 9x80!
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by Archer »

I'm a big fan of the XTPs in other cartridges for self defense use.
I've got another friend who like RD prefers Gold Dots in standard pistol calibers.
I tend to prefer factory Federal HXTs for SD but they don't make them available for reloaders.
I tend to prefer a JFP or semi-jacketed FP for a tough game load over the HP configuration bullets but it's real hard to argue with 9x80Drilling's results.

Likewise, although I do not subscribe to load data dot com, I find their data to be often lacking key details, especially when transcribed. Without a program like QuickLoad it can be sometimes hard to compare published data from different sources where the OAL is listed but happens to be different due to bullet configuration, cannular placement or simply the differences in the test guns used showing a preference for a given round being assembled a different way.
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by Ranch Dog »

I also wonder if the bullets have been improved upon over the years. I haven't looked at that list in years and the number of bullets available and their velocity ranges are better.
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by Moon Tree »

Thanks RD, 9x80 and Archer for all your wonderful advice. This is the best "shooting/gun" forum on the net, because of the members who are so helpful.

9x80, keep us posted about your testings as you prepare for your elk hunt. I will do the same. I've loaded 10 rounds each of the 300 gr XTP's with:

21.8 gr of H-110
22.0 gr of H-110
20.0 gr of Lil'Gun ( I might have started a little high on this one. Richard Lee's Modern Reloading 2nd ed. list 300 grain jacketed bullets as 18.0 to 20.2 grains of Lil'Gun.)

As soon as I get a break in the weather on a free afternoon, I'll send these loads down range.

As a side note: My testing on the range with the .357 XTP's in 180 grain matched the chart list for this bullet at Hornady's website. Bullets recovered from my feed bags filled with saturate saw dust and 1 recovered from a deer looked almost identical to the mushroomed picture of the bullet on the box. That's what lead me to try XTP's in 300 grain .45. Maybe they have improved over the years, I don't know. And, the .45 might not live up to my expectation. We'll see.
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by runfiverun »

the XTP takes up more case capacity.

it always has different data than the other brands of bullets.
[if you switch an xtp in for other data in the 9mm and use the same oal you exceed proof loads]
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by Moon Tree »

Sunday was a warm 47 degree afternoon with very little wind. I had a hour to step out back and shoot over the chronograph. Here's my results:

Rossi .45 Colt with 20 inch barrel.
Starline brass
Winchester Large Pistol primers
XTP 300 grain bullet

H-110 21.8 grains
1. 1439 fps
2. 1465 fps
3. 1468 fps

H-110 22.0 grains
1. 1468 fps
2. 1468 fps
3. 1470 fps I'm surprised the .2 grains more powder didn't increase the velocity more.

Lil'Gun 22.0 grains
1. 1499 fps
2. 1491 fps
3. 1503 fps
THESE ARE LOADS I USED. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR YOUR USE OF THIS DATA

I didn't see any signs of high pressure on the brass or the primers.
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Re: Speer JFP vs XTP in .45 colt

Post by GasGuzzler »

Wow nice!
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