HELP Rio Grande

Rossi's latest and past big game rifle based on the 336 frame!
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Kiwi-Hunter
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by Kiwi-Hunter »

Welcome birddog
Once the brass is fire formed what's it like ? and will it chamber again?
AK47 asked for pictures of the brass, how that going? he could be right with the headspace issues.
I had this with some very hot load locking things up.
Just have to go through the numbers on this.

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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by bird dog »

I did a little more research on the ammunition and it seems that multiple people are were having the same issue as me from the monarch. I found some old brass from it and tried loading the already shot brass, wouldnt load correctly and gave me the same problem with ejecting. Loaded a couple unshot Hornady rounds and everything seemed smooth. I could not find any of the Remington brass that I have shot to try though. I am going to run up to the store tonight and pick up another box or two of different companies to try out, should shoot it in the next day or two to get results. I took a picture or the brass from the monarch though (sorry for quality I dont own a nice camera).
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by Ranch Dog »

The primer marks on the PPU look like they were a bit on the hot side. It will be interesting to see how a US brand performs.
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by akuser47 »

Ranch Dog wrote:The primer marks on the PPU look like they were a bit on the hot side. It will be interesting to see how a US brand performs.
As I admit not an expert on 3030 but def. Looks high pressure from.the primer swell. Also if you look at the shoulders of those cases and compare to unfired. I really do not think it looks normal looks like you have shoulder set back unless that is normal with 3030. Without a reference to unshot proper sammi round hard to tell. We are making progress though. Keep us posted.
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by Arroyoshark »

I've picked up some PPU .308 brass out at range. The stuff was nasty %@*&$ to deal with, constantly jamming in my resizing die. I wasted a few de-priming rods beating the brass out of the die. Not sure what is going on with it, heavy duty brass, hot factory load causing case deformation, or what, but if that is happening in your .30-30, then I would set that brand aside. My suggestion is to see if your store has some Remington .30-30 ammo and try that. It's usually pretty forgiving.
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by bird dog »

I just picked up some remington and wichester to give it shot. I have shot the monarch brand in .380, .45, 9mm, .223, and .243 and I have never had one jam or malfunction, though i only use it for plinking rounds, I sure hope that it is their 30-30 that is causing the problem
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by Arroyoshark »

This link to a U-tube video might give you some additional insight on Monarch .30-30 ammo.

[youtube][/youtube]

There is indication that Monarch ammo is manufactured in Serbia by Privi Partizan.
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by Ranch Dog »

I have a couple of hunters using the Monarch 170-grain 30-30 Win ammo in their Marlin and Winchester rifles. They have not experienced extraction issues, PPU has a good bullet, it has been devastating on whitetails. Monarch is PPU (Privi Partizan) brought into the US by Academy and some other discount stores. I've used Privi Partizan's 7.62x39 soft point ammo and would have to say the same although it would not chamber in my M85 Mini Mauser. It did in my Rossi Single Shot, Ruger Mini-30, and Savage 10FCM. That M85 is back at Century International Arms for a look at it's chamber. It is either small or non-concentric; hence, the chambering problems.

PPU (Monarch) is loaded to the CIP vs. the SAAMI standard. For the 30-30 Win the CIP Max is 46.4K PSI and SAAMI is 42.0K PSI. If your firearm has a tight chamber, that extra 4,000 PSI could make a difference.
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by Tuco Ramirez »

I would fire a round and when it does not eject insolate the problem. Remove the lever and see if you can remove the bolt and cartage by hand to see if that where the problem lies. Bring a cleaning rod with you to punch the case out to see what kind of force it takes?

If you can slide the bolt and case out by hand your problem lies somewhere in the hook up with the lever and bolt. The end section of the lever has to fit into the bolt smoothly.

If the case is hard to remove from the chamber it may just need a good polishing. Most chambers I see these days looks like someone carved them with a pocket knife…. :lol:
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Re: HELP Rio Grande

Post by Arroyoshark »

The .30-30 is designed to work well within a certain chamber pressure window. I have discovered, as many of you certainly have, that if you compared five different rifles of same brand & caliber, you might find three or four slightly different chambers, from tight to sloppy big. Chamber reamers wear and get chattery, requiring more chamber polishing at factory, resulting in a larger chamber. A hot load in a tight chamber is going to get sticky to extract. I used to shoot a lot of metallic silhouette with the same Rem. 700 that I hunted with - it was a budget thing. I used to only neck size my .30-06 cases for both activities. On a hunt, a buddy wanted to borrow some of my rounds, and he attempted to chamber one, jamming it royally in his Savage 110. His Savage had a tight chamber, my Remington had a looser chamber. I decided after that I would always full length resize my hunting rounds from then on. That was over 30 years ago.

A lever action carbine really doesn't have that much leverage, so if round is hot, chamber is tight spec, one might easily foresee difficult extraction issues with certain ammo. I believe that in bird dog's instance, he should stick with SAAMI spec ammo or judicious hand loads, if he reloads, and accept that. A tight spec chamber with the right load should be capable of outstanding accuracy.

Unless bird dog reports back with extraction issues with Winchester and Remington Ammo, I think the problem, at least with his carbine, may likely be the Monarch ammo.
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